Wednesday, February 8, 2012

Prop 8 News

Some of you may remember Proposition 8, the proposed law concerning gay marriage in my home state of California.  It was put on the 2008 ballot, and the voters decided not to legalize gay marriage.

Ever since then, there have been a huge number of trials about Proposition 8.  As I've said earlier, it's been bouncing around the courts like a pinball.  It doesn't seem to make a difference which way the courts rule, because both sides immediately appeal any decision that gets made.

Here's the latest news.  The 9th Circuit held a 2-1 vote, saying that Prop 8 is unconstitutional.  Or in other words, gay marriage has to be legal, because it's illegal to prevent gays from getting married.  So, the decision of millions of voters in 2008 has been overturned by two people, which, I have to say, does not inspire me with a lot of confidence in our government or the voting system.

Either way, I'm 99% sure that this ruling won't make a difference, because pretty soon, the decision will be appealed by both sides.  The people who support gay marriage want to appeal it, because the ruling only affects California.  The people who don't support gay marriage want to appeal it, because they disagree with the ruling.

Now, here's where it gets interesting.  The appeal can go back to the 9th Circuit, but this time, eleven people in the circuit will vote on it, not just three.  Or, the appeal can go to the United States Supreme Court, and their decision will apply to all 50 states.  Where will the appeal be sent to?  What will the decision be?  Will that finally be the last decision, or will we have yet another appeal?  Could they, perhaps, decide to put the gay marriage initiative on the national ballot?  Time will tell.


Sammy said...

All I have to say on the matter that I think it is stupid. I am strongly against gay marriage, and I think that they would even consider the idea is ridiculous. I know that our founding fathers fought to make this country free, but it is crazy that this is what is has come to. If the government was first founded on the Bible, then that proves that it is wrong. The Bible says that homosexuality is an abomination to the Lord. I don't think that is what the people who fought for our freedoms were fighting for, and to tell you the truth, it just makes me sick to think about it.

Anonymous said...

If the issue is causing so much trouble, why does the government have to decide if it's right or not?

Anonymous said...

Hey Sammy I beleive in god too and ya know pray to him, but how do we know the bible tells the truth? It's not like god came down here and was like "I'm going to wright a book of rules." Sure maybe the stuff in the bible is real. Maybe it's not and some guy that wanted to put hope in someones dying heart started the myth of god either way, real or not, I believe in god and I think he loves anyone on this earth,gay or straight. I think that gays should have the freedom to openly love each other and not be judged by it. I really hate people like you that judge people just because of their sexuality and such. I really hope that gay people will be able to marry and live happily some day.

can't wait ta meet you in heaven
Gxmwp(not my real name obviously XD)

Moriah said...

I'm against gay marriage, my parents are etc. Why did they come up with this poll anyways? It just seems ridiculous.

Anonymous said...

The truth is marriage is a religious institution. The government should have nothing to do with it. Everyone, traditional couples, homosexuals, what have you, should get a civil union from the government that affects your end-of-life rights, tax status and what not. Marriages should be determined separately and only by religious institutions, and if a religious institution believes a couple shouldn't be married for whatever reason that would be their right and judgement to make. That's how things are done in Europe, and it makes a lot more sense.

But since our government insists on using the wrong language for unions between two people, we have to have these conversations about whether or not the government is allowed to interfere with how people feel about the morality of certain groups getting married. Over time, rights have been granted to some groups (women are no longer the property of their husband, interracial couples can be married and you cannot force your spouse into bed to guarantee yourself an heir, just to name a few) but unfortunately, that usually comes with the rights and opinions of other groups getting stepped on along the way. The people of California believe that a religious term shouldn't be applied to a union that does not fit within the teachings of their religion. But the court believes they must include these unions under the definition of "marriage" because there is no other place to put them without discriminating these people and stripping them of basic rights that other amendments and laws should guarantee them. It's a tough position, and there isn't really a right answer here.

As long as the courts do not go so far as to say churches, temples, what have you must perform marriage ceremonies for people that do not follow their religious code (and so far all states that allow gay marriage have included a clause in the law that says the do not have to do this) then I think that's the best we'll be able to do until the system has a better way of handling unions between all couples properly.

Justice said...

Dear Anonymous (or Gxmwp):

I don't want to fight with you, but please consider a few things: The Bible couldn't have been written by any one person (or even just a few people), because it has been proven that the various books within it were written over the period of about 1500 years.

Second, if you believe in the existance of God, why are you so skeptical as to the probability of Him giving humankind a 'letter', as it were, detailing how we are to have a right relationship with Him (among other things)? What would be the purpose of acknowledging God as a higher power if one doesn't believe He has direct bearing on their life?
“All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.” (2 Timothy 3:16-17)

Finally, the Lord doesn't hate homosexuals. His Word condemns their behavior as sinful (Romans 1:26-27; 1 Corinthians 6:9), but also states that he doesn’t hate sinners (Romans 5:8). God is against wicked behavior, but is still capable of loving the person perpetrating it.


Anonymous said...

I agree with the person who wrote the third comment. Honestly, government shouldn't mix with religious matters, because it only causes trouble.

But homosexual couples should be given their rights as American citizens. After all, homosexual couples pay the same taxes as heterosexual couples, and it isn't fair to make them pay as American citizens but be treated like they aren't.

Sammy said...


I was not trying to say that God hates gay people. He loves them all the same way he loves to most holy person alive. But that doesn't mean it is right.

You said that you believe God. The Bible is how we come closer to him. But if you believe in God, you have to believe his word. And it clearly says in the Bible that homosexuality is wrong. If it were meant to be, then God would have made it clear in the Bible. But he is against it, because the Bible says so.

I don't want to argue with you. I know that just because I believe it doesn't mean that you, or anyone else has to believe it. I am just saying what I believe, and what God has told me through his word.


Kira said...

Washington State is considering legalizing gay marriage--in fact, very, VERY considering it. :-/ While I am not against people who are gay (I actually have a few gay friends) I do not support gay marriage. God created marriage for a man and a woman, and every day, I thank Him for my mother and my father. It's Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve, guys! :-)

Christi said...

I don't believe in gay marriage. Does that mean that I hate on the actual gay people? No. Does this mean that it justifies beating up gay people (as it does, for whatever reason, for other people)? No. It's simply because I'm a Christian and that's what I believe. That's all. People can't seem to accept that. I've stopped caring for what others have to say, but honestly, whenever I say that, people just make attacks on Christianity and on me. And they don't want to listen to a single word I say. They don't care. They just care about what they think.
I once saw this thing where it talked about stupid people getting married and divorced. At the end it said, "And gay marriage will destroy the sanctity of marriage?" No. It wasn't just that. It had a part in it, though. It only exists for certain people.
I'm actually pretty surprised at the amount of people who are against gay marriage on this comments page. I thought there would be more people for it... that's how many people I've met are, so...

Anonymous said...

But, does Gay marriage actually affect you?
If God really loves everyone (I'm sorry, I'm not religious)he wouldn't hate people for being homosexuals.
Stop thinking it of a marriage between two people of the same gender, and that it's wrong.
It's a marriage of two people who love each other.
Is it wrong to marry someone you love?

Anonymous said...

I think gays shud be allowed to marry! There ppl who have wants and feelings like us!

"1CookieCrumbles" said...

I believe that gay people should not be married. In the Bible, Leviticus 18:22 says "Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman, that is detestable." Whenever my friends and I go onto the tangent about gay people and gay rights, I always through that verse at them. One girl even says "That's why I don't go to your church, because they hate gay people." My church, and I, do not hate gay people, we are against it because it is a sin. Being gay is like having an affair, being a prostitute, or beastiality. It is also the same a stealing, lying, or gossiping. I am Baptist, and I can assure you, all GOOD churches should oppose gay marriage, because that's what the Bible tells us. Men and women were created for each other, two people becoming one flesh.
If good, godly men a hundred and fifty years ago thought their generation was perverse and wicked, they should see the men and women of today.

Also, random people didn't make the Bible. If you have a Bible, you can examine how the Gospel (Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John) is written between each man, you will notice that each man has completely different views on what they witnessed. Matthew 4:4 is my favorite Bible verse, and you should read it too. It explains just how important the Bible is for our spiritual growth. Just make sure you worship God, not the Bible- which many people do.

I am so glad Texas hasn't even tried to pass that law yet. We are very conservative. Sorry if I lectured anyone. :D I get riled up about these matters. God bless!
--Joanna, Texas

Miss. Cellaneous said...

1CookieCrumbles, thanks for your comment! I remembered that verse, but couldn't remember the reference, so I couldn't use it in my arguments over this subject. My main argument, added to that verse, is "Did God make another MAN for Adam's companion? No, He made woman, Eve." It was God's original design to have opposite sexes together, and His decisions are all good. Gaiety is wrong. Yes,God still loves the gay, because He made them in His image (not that He makes anyone gay, you understand. Man makes that decision for himself)but that does not excuse it as a sin.

Anonymous said...

Marriage is not a religious institution. You can get married either by the church OR by the law. So you can't deny gay people to get married by the law. In the United States of America, we have something called separation of church and state. It means our government will not favor a religion (any religion). Also, the whole Leviticus thing is hard to take seriously considering it also says that if you eat shellfish aka shrimp or lobster is an abomination. The Old Testament is absurd to be honest. In Deuteronomy 22:23-24, it says that if a child acts rebellious and disrespects his parents, he will be stoned to death. I can't imagine any good parent doing that to their child. And lets not forget that the Bible has been translated many times and was spread through word of mouth. It is not legit.
Jesus never said anything about gay people. He said to love and respect one another. Treat others the way you want to be treated. If you believe in God, why are you denying something like LOVE to people who don't agree with you or are just different from the norm? It is selfish and ridiculous.
Did you know that there is something called gay therapy? It is psychologically and emotionally harmful and yet people allow this? Please watch this, it will open your mind:

I'm glad this is now banned in Cali but it still exists in the U.S.
I come from New York and being gay, bisexual, lesbian, trans, etc is normal. I know that there are people who are strongly against this but it is sad that you want to force someone to be something they are not. How DARE YOU TELL THESE PEOPLE THAT THEY ARE AN ABOMINATION TO GOD! Who are you to judge? Are you God!? No you are not so who are you to tell them what is right and what is wrong.
This is all coming from a Catholic so don't even try and tell me that that all Catholics or Christians are against gay marriage when there are also gays that are Catholic or Christian too.
How dare you spread the word of God (someone who created us from love) when you are prejudice to people who are different?

Anonymous said...

Some of the beliefs/thoughts featured here sadden me.